Curse

Voltar · Sep 11, 2006, 01:54 AM // 01:54

dude, there can be nothing better than a bigger divide between pve and pvp players, lol. will make the missions easier to finish the first time. i'm one of the people that like to pve and pvp and i'd always had difficulty understanding why people would buy a $50 game and then play only $25 of it so this seems to be a viable solution.

people shouldn't get too hung up over balance issues since it takes (if factions can be an example) about a week and a half to unlock everything in a new campaign (unless you really go nuts getting it done).

i'm glad the pvp-only folks are so excited about it. either it's a game at twice the price or they get every chapter 6 months later than everyone else. guess that would reason to release it concurrently with the full game though that might make me a little uncomfortable.

who knows. yay team!

Voltar · Sep 11, 2006, 02:12 AM // 02:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

Discuss!

don't know how many people are familiar with this word but it generally means that the "whiners" have been asked to voice their concerns and the people who are posting all the "omfg quit whining, complainer!" stuff are out of line.

that being said, those of us to which this doesn't apply don't need to worry about it as it won't affect us in the least as we will have the proverbally "pimped out" green and 15k characters with all the skills long before these come out. let the people be happy man. that's all i'm saying.

Seph7 · Sep 11, 2006, 02:40 AM // 02:40

I really don't like the idea of players being able to unlock skills in PVP by paying for them, until now I actually thought the unlock packs allready releaed where for owners of factions to have the opertunity to unlock skills of the prophecies chapter. Now I realise they where not but you are going to give these players the original prophecies skills handed on a plate.

The only problem I really have with this is the fact it makes balthazar faction obsolete to the pvp only players who choose to by the packs. When balthazar faction has no place at all other than in PVP.

I really dont understand why buyers of the PVP packs will get everything pre unlocked while the pvp/pve players will either have to unlock through faction or pay the extra to get all the unlocks.

Wouldn't it be fairer just to either eliminate faction and give all players access to every skill and weapon etc, instantly wether they be a purchaser of the full game or a pvp pack and releasing the pvp packs at same time as the full game. That way the PVP players dont have to pay for the PVE content they dont want and get their new skills instantly and the pve/pvp players dont get a disadvantage in PVP and dont have to grind away getting faction or gold to unlock all the pvp skills.

The other option would be not giving the PVP packs instant access to all skills but instead just reducing faction to something like 100faction a skill 300 an elite so all players be pvp packers or full gamers could quickly unlock skills even newer players wouldnt strugle getting skills they need.

Of course with these 2 options you wouldn't make as much profit from the people who have bought prophecies but havn't unlocked all the skills and dont want to grind.

I just fill that if you choose to release pvp versions they should be limited versions of the PVE+PVP game and not have the added unlock bonus I'd peffer the abolishment of balth faction as it is not really necessary and doesn't make pvp that much more fun.

-Loki- · Sep 11, 2006, 03:10 AM // 03:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spike

The reason I saw that anet ONLY listens to pvpers is because any time they complain or moan about something that effects BOTH pvp and pve they ONLY listen to the pvpers. EG the EOE nerf.

Arenanet and NCSoft are giving away $200,000+ US Dollars per year in the form of the Guild Wars World Championships. Of course they are going to balance the game around PvP. If something adversely affects PvP, it could look bad for Arenanet trying to sell a balanced PvP game when a self hosted World Championship is won by the abuse of obviously broken skills. Even Izzy said on WoC - If a skill works too well in PvP and PvE, it's going to get rebalanced so it's balanced for PvP, not PvE. PvP is the competitive portion of the game, which is what the skills/mods/etc are balanced towards.

KurtTheBehemoth · Sep 11, 2006, 03:35 AM // 03:35

Hear me out before I am shunned.

Reasons this update benefits PvP players:

1. The PvP only player won't have to purchase the full game and will save $.
2. They won't have to grind in PvE to give themselves the edge in PvP.
3. They will have more competition since this option will attract more PvP players.

Reason this update benefits PvE players:

1. Less people in PvE that don't want to be there. With only people populating PvE that want to be there, the general atmosphere in-game will be more friendly.

2. *READ THIS IT'S IMPORTANT*

With the separation of PvP from the main game this means that all future campaigns should be PvE based. There is no reason to make another chapter like Factions where PvEers are forced to PvP. Arena Net heard the numerous complaints about this and turned lemons into lemonade.

This Marks an important victory for all guild wars players. I never believed that Arena Net could pull it off but this is why I am in Guildwars for life. In one swift stroke the developers have solved the biggest negative issues in my mind.

Thankyou Arena Net,

Brustow · Sep 11, 2006, 06:01 AM // 06:01

I also like this addition to GW.

I've played through the GW:P campaign a few times already and I don't have any intention of playing through the Factions campaign more than once. For now, I only play PVE to go through the campaign. After that, no more than I have to (for items and skills).

I hope that NightFall PVP skills will soon be added to the in game store soon after NightFalls release.

-Loki- · Sep 11, 2006, 06:45 AM // 06:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by KurtTheBehemoth

Hear me out before I am shunned.

Reasons this update benefits PvP players:

1. The PvP only player won't have to purchase the full game and will save $.
2. They won't have to grind in PvE to give themselves the edge in PvP.
3. They will have more competition since this option will attract more PvP players.

Reason this update benefits PvE players:

1. Less people in PvE that don't want to be there. With only people populating PvE that want to be there, the general atmosphere in-game will be more friendly.

2. *READ THIS IT'S IMPORTANT*

With the separation of PvP from the main game this means that all future campaigns should be PvE based. There is no reason to make another chapter like Factions where PvEers are forced to PvP. Arena Net heard the numerous complaints about this and turned lemons into lemonade.

This Marks an important victory for all guild wars players. I never believed that Arena Net could pull it off but this is why I am in Guildwars for life. In one swift stroke the developers have solved the biggest negative issues in my mind.

This will all pretty much be true if they fix the problems between PvP and PvE characters. PvE characters still get too many advantages for you to not use one in a competitive match (multiple armour sets, multiple headgears, more than 2 weapon slots, easier rerolling, etc). Until then, the PvP edition is nice, but doesn't solve all the problems. You are still going to see PvP players getting the normal edition (especially since unlocking a new chapter for PvP players that have been playing this long doesn't take too long).

Paperfly · Sep 11, 2006, 08:16 AM // 08:16

Quote:

2. *READ THIS IT'S IMPORTANT*

With the separation of PvP from the main game this means that all future campaigns should be PvE based. There is no reason to make another chapter like Factions where PvEers are forced to PvP. Arena Net heard the numerous complaints about this and turned lemons into lemonade.

Gah! I love the transitional half-PvP from Factions! It's innovative, interesting, plays like virtually nothing else in PvP OR PvE, and the teams are just randomly-generated enough that you don't have to waste time getting in a team or fighting rank elitism.

Down with unlock packs on the grounds that they might peripherally lead to a game less like Factions according to some obscure reasoning on the part of the poster I just quoted.

/the more PvP and PvE are divided, the more us 50/50 types suffer in our experience of the dillution of the game's design coherency.

JR · Sep 11, 2006, 08:49 AM // 08:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paperfly

Gah! I love the transitional half-PvP from Factions! It's innovative, interesting, plays like virtually nothing else in PvP OR PvE, and the teams are just randomly-generated enough that you don't have to waste time getting in a team or fighting rank elitism.

Down with unlock packs on the grounds that they might peripherally lead to a game less like Factions according to some obscure reasoning on the part of the poster I just quoted.

/the more PvP and PvE are divided, the more us 50/50 types suffer in our experience of the dillution of the game's design coherency.

If you are a PvE player that likes to occasionally PvP, or a PvP player that doesn't mind PvP, then there is no reason why you wouldn't be happy with the 'classic' version. Unlock skills the way you always have, and have access to both sides of the game. Unlock packs in no way negate that, as you are going to unlock skills rapidly through PvE anyway.

These 'PvP versions' are really aimed at the PvP players who simpy don't want to PvE, and therefore will suffer very slow unlocks. Anyone else shouldn't feel that they have to buy them to keep up. Hell even I may buy the PvE version, if Anet doesn't balance PvP and PvE characters; or I just fancy getting my monk a 15k version of the latest armor.

Xenrath · Sep 11, 2006, 09:35 AM // 09:35

I was one of the ones who suggested a PvP Edition and it's good to see that's been taken on board.

The current system means you must buy Prophecies, and then buy PvP unlocks essentially paying twice to save some time. No matter how you cut it that's a vastly overpriced way of doing things.

I'd say it's still a little overpriced for what it is (or, rather, will be) now, but if they release PvP Edition in the real life stores they won't really be able to do much about the price I suspect.

glountz · Sep 11, 2006, 09:37 AM // 09:37

A-Net, I love you.

Excellent move.

Really!

Edit: I hope you will release the Nightfall PUP soon after the Nighfall PVE campaign release. Most casual PvPers have already unlocked most of Prophecies Skills, and don't need to purchase the Prophecies PUP.

Thank you again!

Thallandor · Sep 11, 2006, 10:32 AM // 10:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by KurtTheBehemoth

Hear me out before I am shunned.

Reasons this update benefits PvP players:

1. The PvP only player won't have to purchase the full game and will save $.
2. They won't have to grind in PvE to give themselves the edge in PvP.
3. They will have more competition since this option will attract more PvP players.

Reason this update benefits PvE players:

1. Less people in PvE that don't want to be there. With only people populating PvE that want to be there, the general atmosphere in-game will be more friendly.

2. *READ THIS IT'S IMPORTANT*

With the separation of PvP from the main game this means that all future campaigns should be PvE based. There is no reason to make another chapter like Factions where PvEers are forced to PvP. Arena Net heard the numerous complaints about this and turned lemons into lemonade.

This Marks an important victory for all guild wars players. I never believed that Arena Net could pull it off but this is why I am in Guildwars for life. In one swift stroke the developers have solved the biggest negative issues in my mind.

Thankyou Arena Net,

I see some sense in this being a PvEr, but this is a one sided assumption and should the PvP portion generate more revenue (which i suspect will be the case further down the line) it would be likely that instead of more time being spend on PvE component of the game, the reverse would be case should Guild Wars (slaps own head /doh) becomes a even more PvP focused game with the PvE lost forever as a additional attraction than it already is.

Even though these PvP packs updates dont really affect me as a PvE player, i can understand some of the emotions the old timer PvPers feels towards their hard work now being sold out to accomodate newer sources of revenue. And the divide between the PvP and PvE has even widen even more significantly and what ever which will be the consequences will depend on those who will stay long enough to see it despite all the arguements between players ourselves and Galie from this thread.

The Silver Star · Sep 11, 2006, 11:14 AM // 11:14

I think by doing this they are just looking for ways to reach into our pockets really, if you cant just unlock eg "Monk" skills anymore you will be forced to buy all of them.

pcredsox99 · Sep 11, 2006, 11:18 AM // 11:18

I think this is a great idea I have alot of people at my work that want to play Guild Wars just for HOH but say that they dont have the time to get all the skills that they need.

You have to think about it by the 4th chapter you will have people that have just started hardcore pvp or have been playing for along time to higher ranks in both fame and Alliance faction.So the new people coming in in the 4th chapter would be so far behind some that they would never get a group.

So all in all i think this is a great idea to get more people into Guild Wars.

Paperfly · Sep 11, 2006, 11:25 AM // 11:25

Quote:

If you are a PvE player that likes to occasionally PvP, or a PvP player that doesn't mind PvP, then there is no reason why you wouldn't be happy with the 'classic' version. Unlock skills the way you always have, and have access to both sides of the game. Unlock packs in no way negate that, as you are going to unlock skills rapidly through PvE anyway.

I am perfectly happy with the classic version, thanks.

My point was a bit more abstract than that - I think design coherence is an important thing to maintain for the long-term enjoyment value of the game. Look at what happened to Star Wars: Galaxies when they re-launched and essentially drove their original userbase away*!

I'm still on-average OK with the unlock packs though - my previous post was only intended half seriously, as a counterbalance to the "well, we all know Factions sucked for PvE, right?" attitude that gets flung around a lot.

*Regardless of the original merits of SW:G, of wich I understand there weren't that many. Not my area of interest!

lyra_song · Sep 11, 2006, 02:31 PM // 14:31

I think its a good idea overall by Anet. It pleases the audience its aimed at: the PVP-only players.

Making your customers happy is good.

But...it saddens me that it HAS to come to this. T_T
I like PvE. I like PvP. Why cant everyone else like both? ._.
Why are people so stuck on one side or the other?

< romantic illusion > I wish everyone liked PvE and PvP equally. < /romantic illusion >

gabrial heart · Sep 11, 2006, 02:32 PM // 14:32

I think if you guys are going to do this, then you mine as well go the whole nine yards and offer pvp only packs as a "game module". Example: Going to the store and picking a PVP version of the game or buying it online. Therefore offering the "individual profession packs" for people ONLY that already own a campaign. Basically, if you go out to the store and buy a pvp version (or buy it online) then you would have no use to bother unlocking individual packs anyway, nor would offering those packs require "recoding" anything more then what you already have. This also opens up those pvp folks to future updades to buy the individual packs when new releases come out with skills and profs. Just say on the individual PUP *requires ownership of a full campaign*. This way pvp'ers can still have the unlock packs for individual professions as they do now and those that just want to pvp can buy a PVP versions. Pretty simple really.

On another note, grrrrrr. Why can't you guys offer a *upgrade* to collectors? I want glowy hands, and/or back up dancers, dammit! With the outright mess that collectors for factions was to acquire, there really needs to be a way to upgrade your account to collectors for the $20 difference. Sorry I digress, for this isn't the thread...

Malice Black · Sep 11, 2006, 02:44 PM // 14:44

some ppl like me dont have the time needed to put into serious PvP, i have a business to run and other activities to do.

Blackhawk · Sep 11, 2006, 02:45 PM // 14:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by gabrial heart

On another note, grrrrrr. Why can't you guys offer a *upgrade* to collectors? I want glowy hands, and/or back up dancers, dammit! With the outright mess that collectors for factions was to acquire, there really needs to be a way to upgrade your account to collectors for the $20 difference. Sorry I digress, for this isn't the thread...

Not really the thread but still a valid point, but would then upset the original purchasers of the CE (dont know why when after all it's only a emote, and people are showing the same dedication to the game if they buy it

) like these packs have some of the PvP people who worked hard to unlock the skills and feel they've been sold out.

I don't PvP myself but think this is a good idea and will save people a lot of time if they want to reroll a different profession PvP char.

SpeedyKQ · Sep 11, 2006, 02:52 PM // 14:52

So is it confirmed that these unlocks don't affect skill trainers in Prophecies?

Otherwise I don't see how people can say this doesn't affect PVE.